А что "за бугром"? (год 2008 - Канада и окрестности)

Кто не ленится почитывать английские странички, может найти познавательную информацию на сайте нашего коллеги Martin Leduc из Канады. Мартин весьма активный и деятельный человек и на страницах его сайта http://www.dieselduck.net/ много интересного и познавательного.

Ниже прямое заимствование нескольких постов с его форума
http://www.dieselduck.ca/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=417&start=15

относительно зарплат на которые расчитывают канадские судовые инженеры.

Вот несколько переведенных строчек:

Начинающему стармеху на круизных судах можно расчитывать на зарплату примерно 4600 (канадских?) долларов. К этому добавляются различные бонусы, например возвратный начиная со второго контракта - 100- долларов, постепенно растущий вместе с карьерой от 100 до 400 долларов в месяц сеньорити бонус, ежегодный бонус и такая интересная и незнакомая нам штука, как компенсация обменного курса (пища для размышлений нашему профсоюзу).
Есть еще пенсионные планы, медстраховка и прочие детали, как например срок подачи готовности к работе.


Не обошли стороной канадские коллеги и офшорный сектор. В скептическом комментарий Seagall (Мах) резонно замечает что может быть в "верхних слоях" оффшорной атмосферы зарплаты действительно фантастические, но попасть туда без большого опыта трудно если не невозможно. Расчитывать приходится на 50000 в год, что в общем то выражено в фунтах(!) и само по себе неплохо.

Отмечается также что все больше стран начинают собирать налоги при работе в их терводах. Норвегия, Голландия, Австралия, ЮК.

"Идея что при работе в оффшоре вы заработаете кучу денег больше недействительна, за исключением отдельных случаев. Рынок поставки рабочей силы невероятно расширился в последние годы и предложений сертифицированых специалистов больше, чем необходимо."


Однако же на великих озерах стармехи зарабатывают и 120К в год!


" Salary is about $600/day, depending on your seniority and type of boat. If you are new guy for lakers, you will be a relief second for uncertain period of time,does not matter what ticket you brought. That means unpredictable scedule of work, $32/hour, if you are lucky,you got overtime. Every time regular chiefs will sent your evaluation to the office, so you have to kiss there asses."

Но и тут проблем хватет! Только написал это НАШ, РУССКИЙ парень!
Вот что сказал товарищ Жуков - придурки из Квебека не хотят говорить по английски!

"Re: Chief Engineer wages
by joukov1 » Sun Oct 05, 2008 6:28 pm

hello, it is first time when i posted my reply, but your topic is interesting. I am working with upper lakes for 5 years, and only after 3 years I've got an answer for your question. Salary is about $600/day, depending on your seniority and type of boat. If you are new guy for lakers, you will be a relief second for uncertain period of time,does not matter what ticket you brought. That means unpredictable scedule of work, $32/hour, if you are lucky,you got overtime. Every time regular chiefs will sent your evaluation to the office, so you have to kiss there asses. Remember, there is CADETS PROGRAMM and these lucky bustards will step over your head when they are making their career. 5 years ago I started,now I am chief on training.Crews 50 percent are lasy, suffering from diabetus and not able to do the job,but they have greater SENIORITY,then you. That means that they have better time for vacations, better opportunities for promotions and they have right to choose the ship. You don't. Believe me, I swallowed this 5 years, it is not for everybody. I got my canadian 1class in 1999,but who cares?
Algoma paid same money, but the life is more brutal, not frendly crew, no tools, no hands.
Desgagnes paid less, benefits are extremely cheep (your life insurance on board of tanker loaded with gasoline is $50,000, I am not talking about dental etc.)And can you speak French? 99% of crew is from Quebec and they hate speak English. I worked 2 days with them, it was enough.
Sorry for dissapointing you,buddy,but people must know the truth.
Regards, Russian."

Хотя немного ниже амиго Себастиан оспорил претензии нашего соотечественника (бывшего)?

Мартину тоже не очень нравятся условия, но оплата все же:

...A chief on the largest tug on the coast will make a max of almost 8,400 monthly, or (54 per hour or almost 650/day; starting in 2009) with a 1 day on 1.24 days off factor (and additional vacation)- that's for a 12 hrs day. From my elementary calculations, the benefits kick up the wage an extra 1 - 1.7 k a month....

Читайте далее ...

http://www.dieselduck.ca/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=417

Re: Chief Engineer wages
by The Dieselduck » Fri Jul 15, 2011 3:11 pm

This came up on a discussion group on LinkedIn regarding deep sea pay for cruise ship. Interesting to hear the new payscales... (with one company) also good to see the bonus and US dollar incentives given.

Martin

• As 1st Engineer / Junior chief. USD 4,586 per month paid 12 months per year. After 2 years with Crystal, a Seniority Merit of USD 105 per month, increasing to USD 210 after 3 years, USD 315 after 4 years, USD 420 after 7 years, and then USD 105 extra each three years.
• Return Bonus of USD 1,000 each time a contract onboard is completed, except for the first contract.
• USD exchange rate compensation varying from 0% to 13% on top of the monthly salary. Last month the compensation was 5%.
• Yearly Bonus (depending on results and performance) equals one month’s salary plus Seniority Merit.
• Voluntary Nordben Pension Plan in effect after 12 months, consisting of a 7% contribution from the employer and minimum 2% from the employee.
• UK P&I Club medical insurance. Sick pay and doctor/hospital expenses coverage for 12 months.
• First three months 14 days mutual notice time, thereafter two months mutual notice time.
• Family visits on board allowed after 2 months.
• Normally 13 weeks on/13 weeks off, but the vacation plan is very flexible.
Posted by Jan Arne Bergh


Re: Chief Engineer wages
by Max Oiltemp » Sat Jul 16, 2011 6:19 pm

seagull wrote:
Somewhere between 100 to 120 thousand is the norm. More in the offshore.
rgds

Maybe on a new generation DP3 rig, drillship or large heavy lift/subsea construction/dive support/ROV vessel or maybe a brand new DP3 pipelayer but those are specialty vessels and you don't have a hope of getting one of those unless you have years of experience in the lower ranks. Much of the offshore is supply boats and AHTSs; Tidewater (on an Aberdeen contract - I won't even go into the regional contracts...) and Gulf Offshore, for instance, pay less than £50,000 a year and with the current exchange rate, that's peanuts. I understand Bourbon, Farstad and maybe a few others pay a bit (not a lot) better if you have a European contract but they are few and far between. Rotations can be anywhere from 4 weeks on - four weeks off to 90 days on - 30 days off in the previously (un)mentioned regional contracts.

There can be a bit of a tax break, but it doesn't make up for the losses due to the exchange rates - and there are more and more countries who are taking tax from crewmembers while the vessel is working in their territorial waters - Norway, Holland, Australia and the U.K. to name just four.

The idea that if you work offshore you'll make a ton of money is no longer valid - except in special cases. The labour pool has expanded dramatically in the last decade or so; consequently, for ships with international crews the supply of certificated engineers now exceeds the demand .

Regards,
Max

Еще один пост от Мартина - познавательный и интересный. Американцы посчитали годовой доход разных профессий и моряки оказались в первой десятке! Мартин однако критически оценил это исследование, отметив что до таких зарплат нужно еще добраться по длинной карьерной лестнице!

Re: Chief Engineer wages
by The Dieselduck » Wed Dec 07, 2011 7:14 pm

Just posted on the blog, but thought it would fit here too...

Earlier this year, Georgetown University Center on Education and the Workforce published a study called “What’s it worth? The economic value of college majors”. It’s a US based study, but probably relates fairly well across to Canada, and some other countries.

The thing that caught my engineering eye in this study, was that Marine Engineering / Naval Architecture was listed in the top ten for earnings. Listed below, are the "majors", and their resulting median income in USD.

Petroleum Engineering - 120,000
Pharmacy Pharmaceutical Sciences and Administration - 105,000
Mathematics and Computer Science - 98,000
Aerospace Engineering - 87,000
Chemical Engineering - 86,000
Electrical Engineering - 85,000
Naval Architecture and Marine Engineering - 82,000
Mechanical Engineering - 80,000
Metallurgical Engineering - 80,000
Mining and Mineral Engineering - 80,000

The top ten least earning degrees were…

Counseling Psychology - 29,000
Early Childhood Education - 36,000
Theology and Religious Vocations - 38,000
Human Services and Community Organization - 38,000
Social Work - 39,000
Drama and Theater Arts - 40,000
Studio Arts - 40,000
Communication Disorders Sciences and Service - 40,000
Visual and Performing Arts - 40,000
Health and Medical Preparatory Programs - 40,000

The median income refers to the average income of the highest 75 percentile income and lowest 25 percentile. In regards to Marine Engineering, there is a much wider margin between “25%” stated as 44,000, and “75%” level income stated as 120,000, as oppose to the other in the top ten list.

The report fails to highlight the fact that although the 75th percentile make an average 120k per year, it takes a long time to get there, due to the licensing system. This would explain the lower 25th percentile earnings of 40k a year. Typically (my rough average from the numbers in the study) most graduates of other programs jump right into a 55k per year job, whereas Marine Engineers start at 40k or below.

Another words, yes, the potential to earn a good wage from the Marine Engineering / Naval Architecture schooling program is good, but getting out of school, is just the beginning of the training. Therefore, caution is in order, to hype these wages. Just looking at the topical earning potential does not give a complete story of the training path and its demands.

This unexplained career training load would probably explain why this major is ranked #4 in the least popular despite these fancy earnings potentials.

The study also reveals some other facts about a major in Marine Engineering / Naval Architecture. It is at the top of the list for concentration of men - 97% of the program participants were men. It also ranks #3 as the top earning major for Caucasians, and ranks #8 as percentage of working full time, with 95% of graduates holding full time jobs.

The study also list Marine Engineers and Naval Architect’s occupation, although once again, I believe these numbers are not quite accurate, due to titles and perceptions of the job. They list as us as working - engineers (?) 31%, management 22%, working on installations 12% - these three could be interpreted as working on ships or offshore structures – typically what Marine Engineers do. An additional 9% are listed working in offices, and 7% working in sales.

Some interesting statistic, but like I believe they don’t paint a clear picture of the full career. Marine Engineers already know, this is a pretty solid job when it comes to returns on your learning investment. You can find the full report here; an interesting read.

On a side note...

Time Magazine did a "Top Ten" list presentation on this topic, and they had a picture associated with each of the top, and bottom earning majors. 8 of the pictures for the “top majors” were generally positive in nature, and depicted men at work - another picture was of machinery. The only woman featured in the associated “positive” pictures, although hard to tell, is standing in lab attire, next to a man.

Meanwhile, eight of the bottom ten occupations predominately featured women in somewhat uninteresting work circumstances. Gotta love that entrenched societal sexism; bit of a sad social commentary.

Time Magazine – been around forever, and still has the attitudes to prove it. The picture is from that website.